LMB Quote Game

[voralfred]

(...)
So "Je donne ma langue au cachalot."

I'm not sure it is very safe. The beasty might aim wrong and take your entire head (or more)

So to help you escape this horrible fate here is

Hint #2
The "folktale" is on the fourth day of the Decameron

(No more hints for the bonuses, if they are not found, the game can still go on....)

[voralfred]

[(...)

In the subforum on "IBDOF Reading Group" which is presently discussing "Curse of Chalion" (and which I encourage you to visit and participate to) MidnasKnight noticed that the book from which an acolyte reads to Umegat at the end of the book is really Chaucer's "Canterbury Tales". Indeed it is not Boccaccio's "Decameron" as I originally believed.

However there is an allusion to Boccaccio's "Decameron" in a different book.

So for one full and the next quote:
-book
-context

(...)


Bonuses:
While I am at it, there are quite a few allusion to Shakespeare in LMB's books. One is extremely obvious, and a second one almost as obvious. So to get 1/2 I want both of these in a single post. Mentioning one without the other would make this 1/2 point unavailable for anyone.
Besides these two, I noticed three more, each of which would bring 1/2
There might be more, any other reference to the Bard you can cite would bring 1/2 , but I'll need some details to find it to check for myself that it is unmistakably what you claim it is.
These bonuses can be open-ended, they don't interfere with the pursuit of the game, which depends only on the Boccaccio's allusion.

Hint time!

Main question: neither Boccaccio nor "Decameron" are explicitly named!
What happens is, one character reminds another one of a "folktale" that, according to this character, has a bearing on their present situation (which the other character, LMB and the reader find somewhat exaggerated). But the "folktale" follows closely one of the Decameron stories.

Bonuses: the three Shakespearian references I noticed are extremely short quotes, just a few words, but well-known enough to be recognized. Neither "My kingdom for a horse" nor "To be or not to be", to my knowledge, but about as short, and as recognizable. If you find more, all the better.

Hint #2
The "folktale" is on the fourth day of the Decameron

(No more hints for the bonuses, if they are not found, the game can still go on....)

Hint #3

Decameron, Day 4, Novella 5

[voralfred]

Back to the drawing board.

The question is still the same, but now as a quote

"Were... are you thinking about that Barrayaran folktale where the girl's lover ended up with his head in a pot of basil, when her relatives caught up with him?"

"Pot of basil? No!"

"I thought about it... I think your XXXs could, y'know, if they teamed up. Hand me my head, I mean.... (...)"

Book?
First (identical to third) speaker?
Second speaker?

XXXs are second speaker's relatives.
The first ... are in LMB's text (hesitation? reflection?) the (...) mean I stopped after the fisrt speaker hesitaion/reflection and did not give the end of his reply.

Local bonus: How many are "they"

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

Back to the drawing board.

The question is still the same, but now as a quote

"Were... are you thinking about that Barrayaran folktale where the girl's lover ended up with his head in a pot of basil, when her relatives caught up with him?"

"Pot of basil? No!"

"I thought about it... I think your XXXs could, y'know, if they teamed up. Hand me my head, I mean.... (...)"

Book?
First (identical to third) speaker?
Second speaker?

XXXs are second speaker's relatives.
The first ... are in LMB's text (hesitation? reflection?) the (...) mean I stopped after the fisrt speaker hesitaion/reflection and did not give the end of his reply.

Local bonus: How many are "they"

book is Barrayar
speaker 1 is Koudelka
speaker 2 is Droushnakovi
xxx's are Drou's three brothers

'Scuse the telegram style, my access is timed

[voralfred]

Good try!

I'm sure Kou felt that way about Kou's brothers....but the quote is not from there! Sorry, try again....

[Caroline Tredez]

One generation later, Mark telling Kareen of his paranoia about her family. In the first half of ACC,, before the infamous dinner party, and "they" being Kareen's sisters, that still makes three : Olivia, Marty, Delia.

[voralfred]

Correct!
That's one and a half :sherlock:s and the next question or quote!

[Caroline Tredez]

Ok, so here's the next quote :

"[...] I see I shall have to explain to you the difference between permissionn and forgiveness, sometime."

Who is "I", who is "you", and what is the difference ?

[voralfred]

I'm not allowed to answer yet, but I tried one place I thought it might be, and it was not there.
A little hint so others still have a head start before I can answer?

[Caroline Tredez]

Ok for a little more :

"[...] I see I shall have to explain to you the difference between permissionn and forgiveness, sometime."
"And what is the difference ?" inquired XXX, brows rising.

Again, who's talking (I should think that much easy to guess), to whom (harder to guess, alright), and what's the answer to the question ? (Answer in the sentence following this quote)

[voralfred]

Ok for a little more :

"[...] I see I shall have to explain to you the difference between permissionn and forgiveness, sometime."
"And what is the difference ?" inquired XXX, brows rising.

Again, who's talking (I should think that much easy to guess), to whom (harder to guess, alright), and what's the answer to the question ? (Answer in the sentence following this quote)

You did not ask what book it is.
I have a guess as to the characters, including the second one, but I hesitate between at least two books and several scenes and I am too lazy to check them all.
Is the question about "what's the answer" a bonus or part of the question? Or may I just advance my guess to advance the game and whoever completes the answer gets the point and the next question?

[Caroline Tredez]

Here's your hint : I did not ask for the book, because it's evident from the characters : the second one (XXX) appears only in that book. I tought it was only one question, and I hesitated after your post about making it a question and its bonus, but then one could answer without remembering the scene, it would be less fun. So, still only one question.

[voralfred]

Anyway, I was totally wrong, as I thought that XXX was Ivan.

Back to the drawing board....

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

"[...] I see I shall have to explain to you the difference between permissionn and forgiveness, sometime."
"And what is the difference ?" inquired XXX, brows rising.

Again, who's talking (I should think that much easy to guess), to whom (harder to guess, alright), and what's the answer to the question ? (Answer in the sentence following this quote)

My turn to be wrong.

1st speaker (= I): Miles
2nd speaker (=XXX): Jin
answer to question: succes is its own forgiveness

[Caroline Tredez]

Not yet, but getting closer ^^.

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

"[...] I see I shall have to explain to you the difference between permissionn and forgiveness, sometime."
"And what is the difference ?" inquired XXX, brows rising.

Found it!

1st speaker (= I): Miles
2nd speaker (= XXX): Vorlynkin
answer to question: permission implies ante facto forgiveness for a failed attempt, while post facto forgiveness is granted for succes without previous permission.

[Caroline Tredez]

Got it, next quote is yours.

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

Got it, next quote is yours.

Thanks, Caroline. I'm slowly but steadily climbing up the scoreboard. Not much merit in it though, with so few active participants. Oh well ... here goes my next contribution.

Let's assume that the Nexus wormholes are elastic and have an adapting internal diameter, allowing all ships to pass through, no matter their size (think of peristalsis, the way a snake passes its prey through its gizzard).

But what are the inherent limitations of a wormhole? I mean, in which circumstances can or should a ship NOT pass? (I also mean Lois's fictional wormholes, not the real thing.)

I can think of 7 instances.
State at least 3 to gain 1 point. An instance (or more) that I missed is equally valid, of course.

Bonus question for 1/2 point: Through what kind of wormhole will ships probably NEVER pass.

On a side-note, Lois's wormholes are very similar to the CoDominium's (Jerry Pournelle's universe) Alderson points and tramlines, named for the late Dan Alderson who invented them as an intellectual exercise (and who was an actual JPL scientist). The force dome covering the Celestial Garden (in Cetaganda), though opalescent, is similar to the CoDominium's Langston Field.

"Mister Sulu, warp 5, please. Engage when ready."

[SPetty]

Best guesses right now:
1) when there's a ship already in it (In The Vor Game, Miles notes that the Cetagandans can only put one ship through at a time, no matter the size).
2) when the wormhole's been blocked (like the Barrayarran retreat from Escobar),
3) when there's a significant threat on the other side (black hole, too close to a sun or hot planet).
If you're sane, there's also 4) when there's no net gain from using it (like many of the wormholes at Komarr that go nowhere).

I'm sure I'm missing some obvious ideas, but those are the ones I came up with. Oddly enough, watching Farscape lately (which deals a lot with wormholes) didn't generate any ideas.

I'd be interested to see what I'm missing, though if there's 7, and I can get a point for 3, there ought to be another point for 3 others.

[voralfred]

[
But what are the inherent limitations of a wormhole? I mean, in which circumstances can or should a ship NOT pass? (I also mean Lois's fictional wormholes, not the real thing.)

I can think of 7 instances.
State at least 3 to gain 1 point. An instance (or more) that I missed is equally valid, of course.

Bonus question for 1/2 point: Through what kind of wormhole will ships probably NEVER pass.

I believe Suzette got at least 3 correct answers, so she probably got the point and the next quote. However, you mention 7 instances.

Now I can see 3 more cases where a ship can or should NOT pass, but these are limitations on the ship, really, not the wormhole, so I doubt that counts for another point. Anyway, here are mine (counting beyond Suzette's four suggestions)

5) if the Necklin rods are bent (in _WA_)
6) if the mirror is broken (_Falling Free_)
7) if your pilot's neural implants don't fir the ship's drive; for instance a pilot with an obsolete "color drive" neural implant for a ship with a more modern drive (see _WA_ again)

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

1) when there's a ship already in it
2) when the wormhole's been blocked
3) when there's a significant threat on the other side (black hole, too close to a sun or hot planet).
4) when there's no net gain from using it

Suzette, IMO your #4 is not valid, because "no net gain" is a human limitation, not inherent to the wormhole. Moreover the Betan Survey transits through safe but useless wormholes at least once to explore the region surrounding the other end. Otherwise they couldn't discover it is useless.

But your #3 counts double because you describe two different locations where an exit may be located.
So you do have 4 instances correct which earns you 1 point and the next task.

Now I can see 3 more cases where a ship can or should NOT pass, but these are limitations on the ship, really, not the wormhole ...

Right, so those 3 cases are not valid.

The instances I could think of are:

• 1. a collapsed wormhole (which will keep collapsing until it disappears)
  2. a recent nuclear explosion inside the wormhole
  3. two ships cannot simultaneously enter side by side,
  4. two ships cannot simultaneously enter at opposite ends, because meeting inside would destroy them
  5. a wormhole exit too close to a supernova
  6. a wormwhole exit at the event horizon of a black hole (though it is doubtful a wormwhole exit can exist there; exits are usually at a distance where gravitational attraction is = or < 0.0001% of the gravity of the attracting star's centre; for the solar system this is at +/-100 AU from the sun)
  7. a wormhole exit in an anti-matter region

This list should lead you to the answer to the bonus question. Hint: it has to do with the wormhole's location, like in 5, 6 and 7.

[SPetty]

Ok, I'm going to go for the silly answer to the bonus, mostly because it's late here, and I probably ate too much sugar in the last hour.

A ship will never enter a wormhole on a planet (as in a hole that a worm has dug). I did say it was silly, right?

Anyway, next quote:

"But when, how long, that's the question!"

What book?
Who is speaking?
What's the question (paraphrased is fine)?

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

A ship will never enter a wormhole on a planet (as in a hole that a worm has dug). I did say it was silly, right?

No, I wasn't asking an ambiguous bonus question.
It fits the logic of the Nexus universe. But though it's a safe wormhole, it will probably never be used, unless future ships will be fitted with additional or new technology.

[voralfred]

(...)
4. two ships cannot simultaneously enter at opposite ends, because meeting inside would destroy them
(...)

You are certainly right, on this point. But this raises a difficult question. How can a ship at one end of a wormhole know that there is already another one traveling in the opposite direction, in order to refrain from entering?

Anyway, next quote:

"But when, how long, that's the question!"

What book?
Who is speaking?
What's the question (paraphrased is fine)?

]

[E Pericoloso Sporgersi]

You are certainly right, on this point. But this raises a difficult question. How can a ship at one end of a wormhole know that there is already another one traveling in the opposite direction, in order to refrain from entering?

Traffic lights, of course. Simple but elegant.

Next to each end of the wormhole sits a traffic buoy. The two buoys each emit 3 signals in rotation, something like WAIT, STAND BY, GO, WAIT, STAND BY, GO, WAIT, STAND BY, GO ...
They signal not in simultaneous, but in phase shifted synchronicity. The signals can be radio, coloured light beacons or even flags, and even better all three. The WAIT and STAND BY phases together last 10 minutes or more to give an arriving ship time to leave the immediate vicinity. Of course there are pre-defined approach and departure corridors and vectors also transmitted by the buoys, and each buoy has a silent twin sister ready to take over in case of malfunction.

Only an invading fleet would ignore the entry buoy, except for the fleet's first ship to enter the wormhole.

Finally , all this is moot if Lois ever postulates that an accessed wormhole automatically allows only exiting mass.